Nettle & Bone

Daniella and Evelyne discuss T. Kingfisher's "Nettle & Bone." Is it cozy? How many childhood movies did we reference? Which character was our favorite? And how drunk did Evelyne get by the end?

Transcript

Announcer:

This is Intoxicated Literature.

Daniella:

Hello. Welcome to Intoxicated Literature. I am Daniella Drake.

Evelyne:

And I'm Evelyne Crowe.

Daniella:

And tonight we are talking about Nettle and Bone by T. Kingfisher-

Evelyne:

T. Kingfisher.

Daniella:

... who's also Ursula Vernon.

Evelyne:

Yes, and who I followed on Twitter forever, actually, and I've never read any of their stuff because I thought it was all horror. And I don't read horror, just as a rule. So I had never read any of their stuff, and I'm so glad I read this.

Daniella:

Yeah. So what are we drinking? We are doing themed drinks like we talked about, I think, a couple episodes ago.

Evelyne:

Apparently I get ideas when I drink and then just forget about them, so...

Daniella:

So what are you drinking, Evelyne?

Evelyne:

I am drinking witches brew, which is Midori, tequila, I think there's tequila in this, pineapple juice, and a splash of lemon juice.

Daniella:

It is very bright lime green.

Evelyne:

It looks like witches brew.

Daniella:

It does. It does. Yes. I made up a concoction with the help of my boyfriend, and we call it Bluebeard because-

Evelyne:

Which is fitting.

Daniella:

It's fitting. This is, definitely, Bluebeard is a theme in this novel.

Evelyne:

It feels Bluebeard-inspired.

Daniella:

Yeah, so it's Trader Joe's Cookie Butter Liqueur, because I freaking love that stuff.

Evelyne:

Yeah, that's good stuff.

Daniella:

Yeah. Amaretto, oat milk, and a little bit of blue curaçao?

Evelyne:

Curaçao. I think there's an accent on there.

Daniella:

I think so, too. So, okay, blue curaçao on the top, and it kind of dribbles down, so it looks like a beard. We put egg white so there's foam. Yeah, it was very fancy. Obviously, he made it, and I did not.

Evelyne:

He's quite the bartender, and he makes all of our holiday drinks, so this makes sense.

Daniella:

Yes, he makes all of my drinks because I'm useless. Left to my own devices, I'm like, "This would be great," and I just start pouring stuff in and it is not great, let me tell you.

Evelyne:

I had to make my own drink, so...

Daniella:

Well, yes, but you made a super batch.

Evelyne:

I did. I have a mixing cup full of this so I can just pour into my little cocktail glass here as I drink.

Daniella:

It's impressive. It's impressive.

Evelyne:

It is quite the electric green.

Daniella:

It really is. It really is.

Evelyne:

But I figured the dust-wife is almost a witch.

Daniella:

No, I agree. I was trying to think of which drinks that I could make because I was like, that makes sense. She's kind of like a gravewitch.

Evelyne:

There's spell casting of the kind

Daniella:

She raises the dead.

Evelyne:

Yeah, like a necromancer.

Daniella:

Yeah, it counts. It counts.

Evelyne:

Also, so trigger warnings for spoilers.

Daniella:

Yes. Spoilers.

Evelyne:

We're going to talk about the entire book, beginning to end and all the in-betweens, and I use profanity a lot.

Daniella:

Major plot spoilers. Yes, we swear like sailors. So if that offends you, please don't listen to us. So let's get going. Overall impressions of this book?

Evelyne:

I liked it a lot.

Daniella:

I did, too. I really enjoyed it. It's one of my favorites, I think, actually, which is funny because when I first read it, as I was reading it, I was kind of like, okay, all right, because it's not... I would say it's a lower fantasy. It's not huge stakes. There is definitely dark themes. There's definitely violence. There's definitely gore, but it still feels weirdly cozy. And I don't know how she manages that, dealing with the stuff that she's dealing with, but after I finished it, I thought about it for weeks. It would just kind of rattle around in my brain, and I was like, wow, that was really, really interesting.

Evelyne:

The closest book I can think of that really makes me think of it is Uprooted.

Daniella:

Yes. Yes. I agree.

Evelyne:

It feels the same.

Daniella:

Yeah, I agree.

Evelyne:

Except one is more YA than this one. This one doesn't feel quite as YA.

Daniella:

No, this one does not feel YA.

Evelyne:

This is more adult.

Daniella:

It is.

Evelyne:

But in the same thematic sense with the coziness.

Daniella:

Yeah, I agree, where it's dealing with kind of darker themes and kind of not great things are happening, but there's enough humor and there's enough... I don't know. The characters are so kind and good, which I think is a staple of kind of the cozy genre, that I think that it just gives that vibe of reinforces your faith in humanity a little bit. I really enjoyed it a lot. I liked the world-building. The characters especially were so good.

Evelyne:

They were all so good. All so good.

Daniella:

Marra is a 30-something spare princess, and she's left to a convent. She's like, "You're just going to live in a convent for a while. We don't need you. We're just going to put you on this shelf until we need you."

Evelyne:

Then she's like, "No one else, no one else is saying this? No one else is seeing the problems here? Everyone else is just okay with this?"

Daniella:

I know.

Evelyne:

"We're just okay with this. I'm not okay with this. Earl needs to die."

Daniella:

Yep. Pretty much. Pretty much. Yep, yep, yep. And it's interesting, too, because the beginning of the book, it kind of drops us in the middle of the story because she's already gone to the dust-wife. She's already said, "Listen, I need something that'll kill a prince because he's abusing my sister. So what do you got?" And the dust-wife is like, "Okay, do these three impossible things," and sends her on her way because she thinks there's no way I'm going to see this woman again.

Evelyne:

Oh my God. It cracked me up, too, because she got back with the bone dog. She comes back, she literally almost ruins her hands making this bone dog out of cursed bones and wire. Her hands are not functional practically at this point. She goes back to the dust-wife. The dust-wife opens the door and is like, "The fuck. How did this work? You weren't supposed to be able to do this. I didn't think you'd come back. I thought you'd give up. What do you think I meant when I said this was an impossible task?" Literally, she asks her this question, "What do you think it means when I say impossible tasks?" And Marra's like, "That it's hard."

Daniella:

She's like, "This was just a test to make sure I really meant it, that I really needed to do this thing."

Evelyne:

Literally, I could just see her just rubbing her forehead, like...

Daniella:

Face-palming and being like, "Oh my God, what?"

Evelyne:

"Oh my God." And so Marra's like, "Well, okay, well what do I need to do to catch moonlight in this jar?" And the dust-wife was like, "Okay, okay. You've already done these two things. Open this jar."

Daniella:

She's like, "Hand me that jar right there."

Evelyne:

"Open this jar." And so Marra opens it up, and there's moonlight in it. She's like, "Okay, close the jar." So she closes it. She's like, "Okay, you caught moonlight in a jar. You're done."

Daniella:

Yeah. So good.

Evelyne:

And Marra's looking at her like, "What?"

Daniella:

Yeah, I love it so much. But I love it, too... Okay, let's backtrack a little bit because... Okay, so it drops us in the middle of the scene. It drops us in the middle of the story, which is interesting to me because especially with fairytale stories, it's about the journey. So not starting at the beginning was such an interesting choice. And at first, I didn't love it. It took me a while to figure out what was going on and get into it, but not that long. It was like a chapter, and I was like, no, I'm in it. This is good.

Evelyne:

This is how I write stories, though. This is literally how I write stories. My beginnings are always like this. When I start something, it is always in the middle of the action.

Daniella:

I do not. I like to start with the decision of, oh, I have to do this thing. Okay, I'm doing it. I'm going to do it. It was an interesting choice, but then it kind of inter-cuts with her childhood and how all of these events came to pass and how she ends up sewing a cloak from nettles and building a dog out of bones because such a weird thing to do. And you're like, why do you need these things? This is so weird.

Evelyne:

Marra spends a lot of her life being told that what she does is not okay. Her mother is saying, "You're not political enough." Her sister is saying, "You have to be quiet."

Daniella:

Which is funny to me because she's so shy and reserved-

Evelyne:

She is, yes.

Daniella:

... and unsure of herself for so much of her childhood. She is not comfortable.

Evelyne:

Well, even at the convent, she goes to try to clean out stalls and stuff, and then nuns are like, "What are you doing?" She's like, "I got to do something." She's like, "No, you don't." She's like, "I do."

Daniella:

"Yeah, I can't just sit around."

Evelyne:

"I'm literally just sitting here."

Daniella:

Yeah, exactly.

Evelyne:

So she spends a lot of her time being told, "You're not doing what you're supposed to be doing."

Daniella:

Exactly.

Evelyne:

She's like, "What am I supposed to be doing?"

Daniella:

Exactly.

Evelyne:

So she's literally being told all of her life that she's crazy, stupid, not good enough, literally being told all the time.

Daniella:

By her parents, by her sisters, which is the point that I want to make because they pack up her middle sister, her next oldest sister, Kanya, Kenya, Kania?

Evelyne:

Kania, K-A-N-I-A, Kania.

Daniella:

And she goes off to marry the same prince, and they go to visit her, and Marra sees kind of how she's living and how afraid she is of this Prince Vorling, who turns out is a dick, just really a terrible person.

Evelyne:

Terrible person.

Daniella:

Really bad.

Evelyne:

The worst.

Daniella:

Yeah. Yeah.

Evelyne:

Like the worst. And it's funny because when I saw him, I immediately thought of the Portrait of Dorian Gray.

Daniella:

Me, too. Me, too. That is exactly what I thought. Yes. Instantaneous.

Evelyne:

Instantaneously thought that, okay, there is a picture somewhere that is old and crusty of him.

Daniella:

100%. That is what I also thought. So I feel vindicated and validated and all of those things because I had the same exact thought.

Evelyne:

Literally thought that.

Daniella:

Totally.

Evelyne:

And I'm kind of disappointed it didn't go that way, but I really-

Daniella:

That's where I thought it was headed, though, but yeah.

Evelyne:

Excellent red herring.

Daniella:

Yeah, absolutely. I really thought that's where it was headed, and then it goes in a completely different direction. But yeah, so Marra sees how her sister is living. No, I'm not putting up with this. This is not okay. Someone needs to do something.

Evelyne:

Yeah, Marra's like, "You know what? I'm in this convent, but who says I have to stay there?"

Daniella:

Exactly. She's not a nun.

Evelyne:

She's not a nun. She'd never said any vows.

Daniella:

Nope.

Evelyne:

There's no guard. There's no one forcing her to be there. And so she just says, "Well, fuck this," and she leaves. She goes and finds the dust-wife.

Daniella:

And she's like, "Hey, I need to kill a prince." The dust-wife is like, "The fuck you do."

Evelyne:

The dust-wife is like, "I don't want to do this. I just want to sit here and raise my chickens. I know one of them has a demon inside of it, but I can deal with that."

Daniella:

Couldn't put it in the rooster because that's how you get basilisks.

Evelyne:

Why is there a demon in the hen? And the dust-wife was like, "Well, I can't put it in the rooster. That's how you get basilisks." That's her answer. Not [inaudible 00:12:22]-

Daniella:

Such a practical response. I know. It is so good. I loved the dust-wife. I thought she was so good. She was so sassy, and I loved it. But yeah, she's like, "I'm just going to give this woman three impossible things. She's never going to be able to do them. I will never see her again." And this is what she did. When people came to her for things that they needed or wanted, she'd be like, "Do these impossible things." They're like, "Well, I can't do that, so I guess I don't get this thing." And Marra's like, "Nope, I'm going to do these impossible things."

Evelyne:

"I'm fucking determined. I'm going to do it." And the dust-wife is like, "Well, shit."

Daniella:

Yep.

Evelyne:

"Fine."

Daniella:

And so they go off together. The dust-wife is like, "I'm going to bring my chicken that's possessed because I can't leave it here."

Evelyne:

[inaudible 00:13:09] said you'd give me the tools," and the dust-wife was like, "I'm your fucking tool."

Daniella:

Yeah, exactly. She goes, "It's me."

Evelyne:

"I'm the tool. Let's go."

Daniella:

God dammit.

Evelyne:

"Why are you bringing your chickens?"

"Well, it'd be rude to leave someone else to deal with it. There's a demon in it."

Daniella:

Yeah, she's like, "I can't just leave it here unsupervised. Someone's got to take care of it." It's so good. I love her so much.

Evelyne:

I know. The dust-wife is my favorite. I love her so much.

Daniella:

I know. So good. So the dust-wife takes Marra to the goblin market.

Evelyne:

The goblin market.

Daniella:

Because they're going to get a moth that is going to lead them to what they need. And this is where they pick up their next companion as well-

Evelyne:

Fenris.

Daniella:

... who is Fenris? He's a knight-

Evelyne:

After the tooth extraction. Do you remember the tooth extraction, which was upsetting?

Daniella:

Yeah. I was just going to say it was very upsetting. I didn't like it. It was like a pelican or a stork or something, too, which was also weird.

Evelyne:

And I also thought we were just going to pull the tooth out, but that's not what happened. Every tooth in her mouth vibrated in a very upsetting way.

Daniella:

It was probably the most upsetting scene in there for me.

Evelyne:

I think so.

Daniella:

Which is amazing.

Evelyne:

Which is saying something.

Daniella:

Yeah. Yeah.

Evelyne:

I was not happy with that.

Daniella:

I did not like it. No, I didn't like it.

Evelyne:

I think the tooth scene was the most... of all the scenes.

Daniella:

Yeah. I didn't enjoy that scene. That was the worst ones, but she does it, like Marra decides she has to save this guy because he's not being treated well. She's like, "I can't-

Evelyne:

He was essentially a slave, had a collar on, he was just in the back.

Daniella:

Yeah. She was like, "I can't just leave knowing this guy is going to be here for however long, being a slave. This is not okay." Again, she's just like, "Nobody's going to do anything, so I'm going to do it. You want one of my teeth? Fine. Great."

Evelyne:

Yeah, that was blah.

Daniella:

So Fenris goes with them, and the moth takes them... Where's the moth take them? It takes them to a safe haven, doesn't it?

Evelyne:

No, it doesn't. The moth takes them to Fenris.

Daniella:

Oh, that's right. That's right. The safe haven is later.

Evelyne:

Yeah. The safe haven is from Agnes.

Daniella:

That's right. Agnes, the other one I just really adore.

Evelyne:

Who is the godmother for all of the daughters.

Daniella:

Marra's sisters, their family, Agnes has been the one to bless them at their birth, which is super ironic because Agnes-

Evelyne:

Is really good at curses.

Daniella:

She's not very good at blessings. But she is-

Evelyne:

The only blessing she can give is good health.

Daniella:

... very good... Yeah, she's very good at curses.

Evelyne:

Absolutely. And she curses this poor chick, an actual chick from a chicken, to find a safe haven or it will die. So it does. It finds a safe haven, which is an inn. It was a really upsetting...

Daniella:

This was also upsetting.

Evelyne:

Margaret and her cursed child.

Daniella:

Yes, which is basically a puppet, a marionette.

Evelyne:

So what happens in this world is if there's a very lonely child and there's a toy that they love, this toy becomes their own personal god essentially. They pour all their fears and their loves and all of, they just talk to it, and they become very attached to it. And at some point, by some stroke of luck or magic, somehow it comes alive, and it becomes their own personal... It's attached to them. It doesn't talk to anybody else or anything, and it chokes her, every-

Daniella:

It's disturbing.

Evelyne:

It's upsetting.

Daniella:

Yeah. It's very disturbing. And they're sitting there having a conversation with her, and this marionette is pulling on this rope that's tied around her neck, just pulling on it.

Evelyne:

Anytime it thinks that there's any danger that they will separate the puppet from Margaret, it chokes her.

Daniella:

Pulls on. Yeah. It's very upsetting. And it's interesting because Marra, in particular, is upset by this. She was like, "We need to save her." And the dust-wife is like, "Okay, let me show you. Let me show you what happens when I save her." And she separates them. And Margaret chooses to have the puppet reconnect. She chooses to have this, I don't even know what to call it, thing attached to her, making her decision. Yeah. It was very gross.

Evelyne:

The dust-wife says, "We can only separate them if Margaret chooses. It's her choice."

Daniella:

Margaret said no, and she runs kind of like a hostel for travelers. And surprise, surprise, not a lot of people choose to stay there because it's creepy.

Evelyne:

Creepy as fuck. And Marra's like, "What if the thing decides to kill us in our sleep?" And the dust-wife's like, "Eh. It can't leave her."

Daniella:

Odds are small. Yeah.

Evelyne:

It's attached to her.

Daniella:

Can't really can do anything on its own. Yeah. It's really only about her.

Evelyne:

And Marra's just like...

Daniella:

Yeah, Marra's like, "I don't like anything about this."

Evelyne:

But it's also the first time that we see Fenris and Marra talk to each other, a little bit of romance.

Daniella:

The romance is definitely subtle, and it's not the main focus for sure.

Evelyne:

It's not even romantic. It's more just like budding friendship connection, which is cool.

Daniella:

Yeah. I thought it was very sweet, though.

Evelyne:

Yeah.

Daniella:

So that was nice because a lot of the book, Marra's like, "I have no interest in marriage. I have no interest in kids. I'm happy on my own." She's a 30-something woman. She's like, "I'm great. I've got my independence. I'm seeing how my sister's being treated. I'm like, 'No, thanks.'"

Evelyne:

Well, we learn a little bit about Fenris, too, because both Marra and Fenris had pretty decent parents. They did not realize a lot of the suffering that other people had at the hands of their own parents. And Fenris learned shockingly that other kids did not fare so well, and he didn't listen when a kid expressed their fear.

Daniella:

And the kid ends up dying.

Evelyne:

Yes. And his reaction was justified in my opinion.

Daniella:

I agree.

Evelyne:

He killed the dad. He was just like, "The fuck." And he hid out in a fairy hill, and that's how-

Daniella:

He went to the fairy hill to be judged.

Evelyne:

Yes, that's true.

Daniella:

He went to the fairy hill to be judged because he knew that technically, killing this guy was wrong. But he goes to the fairy hill and ends up in the goblin market, and that's where he was when Marra and the dust-wife found him. They're now a troop of four. And they're like, "How the fuck are we supposed to get into a castle and kill a prince?" And Marra goes, "Don't worry about it. My sister's pregnant. She's going to give birth any day. I'm going to be invited. We're going to go and we'll figure it out."

Evelyne:

"I deliver babies. That's what I do."

Daniella:

Exactly. And everyone's like, "Okay, but that doesn't really feel like a plan."

Evelyne:

So they decide to go visit. So Agnes is like, "I should go talk to the grandmother."

Daniella:

Yes.

Evelyne:

Like grandmother to grandmother.

Daniella:

The godmother.

Evelyne:

Oh, the godmother. Godmother to godmother. And everyone's kind of like, "Agnes, really?"

Daniella:

I mean, that's why they brought Agnes along is because this godmother was in the picture.

Evelyne:

To be fair, Agnes seems a little flighty.

Daniella:

She is a little flighty. So Agnes's kind of flaw is that she does not recognize, she will not use her greatest strength. She refuses to use her greatest strength. I can't blame her.

Evelyne:

I don't blame her either.

Daniella:

She wants to be good. She wants to bless people, but that is not what her power is good for. Her power is to curse people, and it sucks. And this is part of her growth is acknowledging that that's what she's good at and kind of using those powers for good in the greater scheme of things, but acknowledging that that's what she has to do.

Evelyne:

So she's like, "I'm a godmother. She's a godmother. I'm going to go be like, 'Hey, I heard you're a godmother.'"

Daniella:

Yeah, "Let's just bond about the fact that we're godmothers." And it's weird. It's weird when they see the godmother.

Evelyne:

It is.

Daniella:

Because she basically has blessed this royal family with immortality in a way.

Evelyne:

Well, she did. The king way back when, a few generations back-

Daniella:

Like one of the first kings-

Evelyne:

... was like-

Daniella:

... of this country.

Evelyne:

... bound her to the royal family. It was not something that the grandmother intentionally-

Daniella:

Godmother.

Evelyne:

The godmother. I keep saying grandmother. Sorry.

Daniella:

I know.

Evelyne:

The godmother intentionally did.

Daniella:

Right.

Evelyne:

That was not her goal. She did not want to live forever. She did not want immortality.

Daniella:

No, absolutely not.

Evelyne:

She was forced to do this. And in order to do this, she is drawing on the energy of the royal family.

Daniella:

So the male heirs of this family die young, all of them die young because she is drawing on them to keep herself alive so that she can keep the next generation alive.

Evelyne:

Yes.

Daniella:

It's pretty fucked up.

Evelyne:

It's very fucked up.

Daniella:

So this woman is pretty ready to die at this point. She's been alive for way too long.

Evelyne:

Way too long.

Daniella:

She is barely there.

Evelyne:

Yes, but the other side effects of this is that she's also said there's a warning. You have no additional magic. You're protected from any additional curses, enemy curses, and usurpers.

Daniella:

Yep.

Evelyne:

So they're pretty much protected internally as long as she draws breath.

Daniella:

Yep. So basically they have to kill this godmother in order to kill the prince, and there's not really a way to do it. So they go to see this godmother, and she basically is like, "I don't really want to be here either. I hope you figure it out."

Evelyne:

But at the same time, she draws Marra into this conversation about this tapestry, and Marra's like-

Daniella:

And it's an ugly tapestry. It's so ugly. And Marra's going, "This is the ugliest thing I've ever fucking seen."

Evelyne:

And then she feels like she's been used-

Daniella:

"I don't want anything to with this>'

Evelyne:

... and spell passage. She's like, "I don't don't know why she showed me..." And she's like, "You should take this tapestry." She's like-

Daniella:

And she gives it to her.

Evelyne:

... "I don't want this ugly ass tapestry. And I feel like, why are you giving me this? And I feel like, what is the point of this? I don't want it. It's weird."

Daniella:

But she takes it.

Evelyne:

She does.

Daniella:

Because it's polite.

Evelyne:

She's polite.

Daniella:

Yep.

Evelyne:

She's been raised as a princess.

Daniella:

She's like, "I guess I have this ugly tapestry now. Yay."

Evelyne:

"I don't know what I'm going to do with this tapestry. It's fucking ugly. Thanks?"

Daniella:

And so they leave this godmother, and they're kind of reconvening, and they're like, "What do we do? How can we find answers for how to break this bond between the first king and the godmother?" And the dust-wife is like, "We have to talk to the first king."

Evelyne:

Yeah, "I talk to dead people."

Daniella:

"You have to talk to the first king. I talk to dead people. That's what I do. I basically am a gravewitch."

Evelyne:

"That's what I do. I'm your tool, man. Let's go."

Daniella:

So they go into the tombs underneath the castle.

Evelyne:

The crypts.

Daniella:

Yeah, where the royals are buried, and they encounter the thief wheel.,

Evelyne:

Which made me think of Labyrinth.

Daniella:

Yes, 100%. Absolutely. Me too.

Evelyne:

I don't know if that was intended, but all I can think of was Labyrinth.

Daniella:

Me, too. And most people manage to evade it except for Marra. And Marra gets kind of scooped up in this thief wheel that's down there to make sure that nobody who's unauthorized is down there, basically.

Evelyne:

Well, this is after, though, they find the really irate mistress of one of the kings.

Daniella:

And then, because Marra's separated now because she was in this thief wheel situation, she realizes the tapestry actually has a secondary purpose.

Evelyne:

Yes. It's a fucking map.

Daniella:

It's a map. It's a map of the tombs.

Evelyne:

The godmother, sneaky ass bitch, was like, "Hey, I made a map for you."

Daniella:

"You should take this with you. Wink, wink, nudge, nudge."

Evelyne:

"Look what I did."

Daniella:

It's so good. So Marra's like, "I'm just going to follow this map." And then she pops out next to where everybody is at this boat, and the dust-wife is like, "Hey, it's you. You found us."

Evelyne:

She's like, "The thief wheel landed on you." And she's like, "Eh. Kind of."

Daniella:

Yes, but this was the thing is that, because Marra wasn't there to steal, I think it let her go or something like that, right?

Evelyne:

She wasn't a thief.

Daniella:

Yeah, her intentions were not to take anything. She was like, "I literally don't want anything from here. I don't want to be here either."

Evelyne:

"Really don't want anything, guys. I really don't want to be here. Can you let me go?"

Daniella:

So it just kind spits her out like, "Well, okay."

Evelyne:

She's just finding loophole after loophole after loophole.

Daniella:

I know.

Evelyne:

Marra is literally, "Swear to God, I'm not here to steal the gold and silver."

Daniella:

"I could not care less."

Evelyne:

"I don't want what everybody else wants. I just want to kill the fucking ghost of the king. Okay? I don't want to steal anything. I'm the black sheep. I am not like everybody else. Okay?"

Daniella:

Exactly. Exactly. Oh my gosh, so good. I love it so much. She finds herself in these situations, and she's just like, "No, but that's not what I want." They're like, "Oh, okay. You're free to go then."

Evelyne:

"Whatever. Okay." Oh my God.

Daniella:

Oh my God.

Evelyne:

So they find the king, and he's all old and crusty and bitter, as an old white man is.

Daniella:

Yep.

Evelyne:

He was the boomer-est of boomers.

Daniella:

He was such a boomer.

Evelyne:

He really was. If you could just take the essence of boomer and put him into the ghost of that king, that's what T. Kingfisher did.

Daniella:

Yep, yep. Agreed. Yep. Nailed it.

Evelyne:

And the dust-wife yelled at him a lot and then made him go. And then, the godmother showed up, just showed up. It's like, "Well, I felt him go, and I thought I'd come and say goodbye."

Daniella:

Yeah. And you're just like, "Okay."

Evelyne:

"I thought I would like some tea before I go." And you're just like, "What the fuck?" She's literally falling apart.

Daniella:

Yeah. Yeah. She's literally, pieces of her are falling off.

Evelyne:

At this point, I'm getting Dark Crystal vibes.

Daniella:

Yes.

Evelyne:

It's literally all of my childhood movies.

Daniella:

In one book.

Evelyne:

In one book. Totally Dark Crystal vibes. She's just falling, like pieces of her are falling off. There's just bone in her knee, and she's like, "Agnes, could you hand me some tea?" And Agnes was like, "Of course." And Agnes is crying. And I'm just like, "Wah."

Daniella:

I know. Yeah.

Evelyne:

And then she dies and just pulls apart.

Daniella:

And it's sad, but it's not. It's sad because she was forced to do this thing and live for so long, and you're just like, "Oh my God, that was horrible." But then she finally dies and you're like, "Well, it's sad that you didn't get to live your own life, but I'm happy that you're now not here."

Evelyne:

I'm happy that the curse has ended.

Daniella:

Yeah, you're free now, which makes me happy.

Evelyne:

I didn't know her well enough to be sad personally.

Daniella:

It was bittersweet, I felt like, because of the lost potential.

Evelyne:

Also, she's a pile of dust on the floor. It's kind of weird.

Daniella:

Yes, that, too. Yes. That was like Buffy vibes.

Evelyne:

Yeah. I'm still getting Emperor from Dark Crystal vibes though, too.

Daniella:

No, that's fair. That's fair.

Evelyne:

It was a little weird for me.

Daniella:

Yeah, it was. It was. But then they're like, "Well, I guess now we can kill the prince."

Evelyne:

So now they're like, "Okay."

Daniella:

So they go upstairs, and now, at this point, Kenya or Kania or whatever her name is, the sister has had a baby, it's a healthy baby, and everybody's celebrating-

Evelyne:

The christening.

Daniella:

... except for Marra, who knows they're now on borrowed time. Because now that she has delivered a healthy, happy baby, her sister's life is in real danger because he doesn't need her anymore. And so the timetable has moved up significantly. They do not have time to fuck around anymore. It is like now we're at war.

Evelyne:

She's up by her sister, just like, "You need to shut up."

Daniella:

Yep.

Evelyne:

"You don't say anything."

Daniella:

Yep.

Evelyne:

"I know more than you do right now, and you do not say one word."

Daniella:

One word, not one word.

Evelyne:

And the prince is like, "Where is the godmother? She needs to be here. What is happening?"

Daniella:

And he's pissed off and yelling.

Evelyne:

He's pissed off and yelling, like men do.

Daniella:

That's how he does all the time.

Evelyne:

And Marra's like, "Oh, it's all fine. The godmother's here." And then fucking Agnes pulls out her evilness, like fucking Maleficent, and transforms into this giant being with green eyes of fire, comes storming into this amphitheater, and everyone's like, "Ooh. Aah." And Vorling's like, "Who the fuck is this?" And Agnes is like, "I will bless this child," and all evil and creepy. And Marra's like, "Oh, look, a godmother."

Daniella:

"Aren't we lucky that this godmother showed up?" And her sister's like-

Evelyne:

Like the first [inaudible 00:32:36] in history-

Daniella:

... "Are we?"

Evelyne:

And Kania's like, "What the fuck is happening?" And Marra's like, "Shut up."

Daniella:

"Just go with it, okay?"

Evelyne:

Because everyone's looking at the big green-eyed monster over here, Fenris was just like, "I stab thee." And then-

Daniella:

Pretty much. He just walks up to the prince, is like, "You're dead now."

Evelyne:

I know.

Daniella:

And stabs him.

Evelyne:

I know.

Daniella:

And the prince is like, "Ha ha, you can't stab me." And he's like, "Oh, wait. No, that actually doesn't feel good."

Evelyne:

And he dies.

Daniella:

And he dies.

Evelyne:

And everyone's like-

Daniella:

Dies. Yeah.

Evelyne:

But then they arrest Fenris.

Daniella:

They do. They do.

Evelyne:

Now, this was actually one of the most realistic things.

Daniella:

Agreed

Evelyne:

Of this book.

Daniella:

Yeah, I agree.

Evelyne:

Because in other fantasy novels, people would be like, the queen would give him a pardon, and he was released or whatever. That's not what was fucking happened.

Daniella:

No, no, no. The sister goes, she's like, "Yes, arrest this man. He killed the prince. I sentence you to being buried alive in the tombs. Get down there, fool."

Evelyne:

I know. Because that's actually what would fucking happen. She has to secure her place as queen, and in order to do that, she has to condemn the king's killer to death. That is actually what would have to happen.

Daniella:

But she's smart enough to know that if he is "buried alive," quote, unquote, in the tombs, they can get him out.

Evelyne:

Yeah, she's not stupid.

Daniella:

Yeah. So she's like, "Yeah, I'll just bury him down there. Wink wink. Go get him."

Evelyne:

"Marra, go get fucking Fenris. Get out of here."

Daniella:

Exactly. And she solidifies her power, and she becomes queen, and it is fucking awesome.

Evelyne:

Go women.

Daniella:

Yeah. Go women. So good.

Evelyne:

It's amazing.

Daniella:

It was so good. And then the dust-wife and Agnes end up living together. And it is adorable, and I love it.

Evelyne:

Bickering old ladies. So amazing.

Daniella:

So good. So good.

Evelyne:

This is awesome.

Daniella:

I know. I love them. They're so funny.

Evelyne:

And Fenris and Marra end up together.

Daniella:

Yeah. It's very sweet.

Evelyne:

At least we assume.

Daniella:

Yeah, it's very sweet. I kind of feel like this is a T. Kingfisher kind of thing, because in Swordheart, which is another one of her kind of cozier books, the romance is there, but it's just kind of underneath. It almost feels like an afterthought.

Evelyne:

Romance is not something that has to be the forefront of everything.

Daniella:

No, and it's just sweet. It's just a sweet little addition, where you're just like, oh, I'm so happy they found someone. They're not alone anymore. And it doesn't need to be more than that. That's fine. That works for me.

Evelyne:

And it's so often, and I know in a lot of, I'm on BookTok a lot, and people put so much focus on the romance aspect of it, but part of feminism, part of independent women is the fact that you do not need a partner to do things.

Daniella:

Yeah, exactly.

Evelyne:

A partner's fine. There's nothing wrong with having a partner.

Daniella:

Absolutely not.

Evelyne:

And it took a group of four to do this, but it should not be. The romance aspect does not need to be-

Daniella:

No.

Evelyne:

... the focus of a book.

Daniella:

Absolutely not. I agree. I loved how this book handled all of it, to be honest, because Marra starts out so timid and unsure of herself. And by the end of the book, she's like, "No, I've got this. I can handle this. I know that I can make the decisions that need to be made. I know that I can do this. I don't need someone else."

Evelyne:

Well, she's been told her whole life that she wasn't making the right ones.

Daniella:

Exactly. Her whole life, "You're doing that wrong. You're doing that wrong. You're doing that wrong." She couldn't do anything right, so she just stopped trying. At some point, you're like, okay, well, I guess I just won't do anything because I can't do anything right.

Evelyne:

I know.

Daniella:

And then by the end of the book, she's like, "No, I am doing this the way I want to do it, and I don't care if you like it or not. But also, you can stay because you're handsome and I like you."

Evelyne:

"Well, I guess you can hang out."

Daniella:

Exactly. That's kind of how it is.

Evelyne:

I know.

Daniella:

"Yeah. All right. I guess you can stay. I kind of used to you being around, so..." But I really did enjoy this book. It's one of my favorite books. I really liked it. I thought it was super cute.

Evelyne:

It had so many different fairytale elements woven through it while at the same time being completely original.

Daniella:

Yes, exactly.

Evelyne:

And that's what made it enjoyable.

Daniella:

Absolutely.

Evelyne:

It wasn't just a retelling.

Daniella:

No, definitely not.

Evelyne:

It was a new story that drew on elements from a lot of different fairytales or movies, modern movies. It drew on all of these different things that reminded you of different things.

Daniella:

Yeah. It made you go, "Huh. It's reminiscent of this," but that's not what it was.

Evelyne:

It wasn't that.

Daniella:

It wasn't just regurgitating. It was very original. It was very creative. Yeah. I really enjoyed it. I definitely think you should all read it because it's really-

Evelyne:

Absolutely, 100% recommend you read.

Daniella:

I know we spoiled it for you, so if you haven't read it yet, well, you still should because it's better when you read it.

Evelyne:

You were warned. I don't know what to tell you.

Daniella:

Exactly. Exactly. So next time, we're going to read Kushiel's Dart by Jacqueline Carey.

Evelyne:

This is my favorite book of all time. My one tattoo is because of this book.

Daniella:

Yeah, and it makes sense to me because I also love this book, the first three in that series. So good. So good. I can't wait to talk about it.

Evelyne:

Yay.

Daniella:

All right, well, I am Daniella Drake.

Evelyne:

I'm Evelyn Crowe.

Daniella:

And this has been Intoxicated Literature.

Announcer:

Thank you for joining us for this episode of Intoxicated Literature. Drink well, friends.